Responses

1. Suman says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 10:43 am (#)

   Don’t bother about com­ments by Anony­mous losers. The very fact that he/she wants to remain anony­mous proves that they are not con­vinced about their words or ideas. They are prob­a­bly ashamed and hence hide behind their anonymity. There fun­da­men­tal­ist, racist peo­ple will keep scream­ing. Ignore them. Ignore the petty politi­cians that crave for atten­tion. It is only a mat­ter of time before these losers will find another issue to scream about.

2. usha says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 10:55 am (#)

   A few years ago, only politi­cians spoke like this — of course we all under­stand it when such crap comes from them. It is such a dis­ap­point­ment when such non­sense comes from the elite( an eng­lish speak­ing, blog reader/ com­menter obvi­ously belongs to the top 5% bracket). It is clearly a sign of a dis­ease — let us not ignore it and allow it to spread. Let us counter it as and when we meet it.

3. Pranjal says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 3:32 pm (#)

   Glad you made that post. It’s a shame we still have such igno­rant fools in a city that brags about being cosmopolitan.

4. Mannina maga says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 4:23 pm (#)

   I read your man­u­fac­tured anguish about being called an out­sider. I was more than amused by it. Why did you move out of mum­bai after 5 years ? You didnt feel for that place any­way. You are just yet another per­son think­ing about your inter­ests and not for any larger ideology/concept/people. You just want bet­ter roads so that you can live in peace.

   But you mas­quer­ade as some holier than thou.. This is the infos­cion cul­ture. Have a twist to your inter­est so that oth­ers will work towards sat­is­fy­ing your interest.

   After­all you only talk of ban­ga­lore and your global cit­i­zen ideas. What about those liv­ing out­side ban­ga­lore (lit­er­ally and fig­u­ra­tively) ? dont they deserve any bet­ter ? How come you dont talk about them ? If kan­nada is enforced all over the place, would you still live here ? If you were in chen­nai would you still be talk­ing the same things ? Well you can make these ques­tions rhetoric for which we all know the answer or you can actu­ally start soul searching.

   Bad roads bother you, dieing peo­ple doe­sent. There lies the super­fi­cial­ity of your approach. Peo­ple like you dont even vote. The une­d­u­cated biharis have the respon­si­bil­ity to travel all the way just to vote. You dont.

   I have lived in delhi and know how non-hindi peo­ple are dis­crim­i­nated. That includes many of my friends from the nort east (call­ing them chinkis and call­ing tamil folks LTTE). Why is it that you dont have the same treat­ment out here in ban­ga­lore ? and wher­ever you may be work­ing, take a look at how many kan­nadi­gas are there. Take a stock, start from there and let me know how IT has benifited Kan­nadi­gas. The peo­ple whos home are rou­tinely stolen in the name of IT, devel­ope­ment and GDP.

   I think your tears are crockodilian.

   Why should kan­nada not be forcibly enforced in ban­ga­lore to benifit kan­nadi­gas when the same is done in delhi where hindi is enforced, the same in cal where ben­gali is enforced ? or in tam­land where tamil is enforced. Whats wrong with this model apart from shock and unna­cept­abil­ity and being on the receiv­ing end. Have you ever tried to grap­ple with this mat­ter and find out what hap­pens to the kan­nadiga com­mon man ?

   Britain, EU, USA are all ask­ing the same ques­tion today. Whom has this cos­mopoli­tanism benifited. I am sure you would have vis­ited the trendi­est spots in ban­ga­lore. That is your view of ban­ga­lore. Ever gone beyond that ?

   Japan is purely japan­ese and almost every­thing is owned by japan­ese because of the insu­lar­ity of that soci­ety. I think they have bet­ter adapted to a chang­ing world than those who had opened them­selves to liberalisation.

   @suman — IT doe­sent mat­ter that I am anony­mous. What mat­ters is my ideas. Please dont be under the impres­sion that blog world is the real world.

   @usha — You said it. Top 5 % edu­cated elite. A french philoso­pher said edu­ca­tion should lib­er­ate your mind and fight against elit­ism. I donot quiet agree that the top 5% elite can be called educated.

   @Pranjal — Cos­mopoli­tanism is no virtue.

   Irre­spec­tive of weather i am anony­mous or not, I would still say what I have to say and anita, its still your blog. I am just a com­menter try­ing to prick through the bub­ble you live in. I cant tol­er­ate elit­ist com­ments and no-dont-question-me atti­tude. That bird lives in africa and is called ostrich. Between being the ostrich and a loser (as suman loftily quoted), I chose the later and why not ?

5. Amit Sharma says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 8:41 pm (#)

   Mr Loser is fight­ing a los­ing bat­tle. We should carry on with our lives with­out pay­ing any heed to the crap he talks. No amount of jus­ti­fi­ca­tion can con­vince our dear friend.

   Anita carry on the good work. Keep inspir­ing. We all love Ban­ga­lore!!! Do update about the next blog­gers meet :)

6. paavai says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 8:56 pm (#)

   I am not sure, if we should totally ignore the com­ments made by man­nina magaa . Per­son­ally I would like to intro­spect and dwell deeper into some of the sta­tis­tics pre­sented, even though I am NEVER going to con­cur with the extreme view points presented.

7. Sameer says:
   

   November 22nd, 2005 at 9:47 pm (#)

   “I have lived in delhi and know how non-hindi peo­ple are dis­crim­i­nated” : So Mr Magaa — Are you try­ing to do the same now here in Ban­ga­lore? Is it your revenge that’s direct­ing you? Instead I sup­pose you should try harder to see to it that Ban­ga­lore treats all it’s cit­i­zens at par and set an exam­ple for other cities to fol­low. India is one, we all are one! Let’s respect our peo­ple and our unity in diversity!

8. Kishore says:
   

   November 23rd, 2005 at 8:04 am (#)

   My is — has the IT indus­try benifit­ted the local cit­i­zens of Ban­ga­lore more in aspects of employ­ment and bridg­ing the gap between the rich and poor or is it otherwise?

   I believe any indus­try that comes into a place should first work towards emply­oy­ing the peo­ple of the place and ben­e­fit the locals. I am unsure as to how IT has helped those guys on whose agritul­tural land it builds its IT Parks.. And how many imme­di­ate locals does the IT in ban­ga­lore employ, after­all if the peo­ple of the place don’t ben­e­fit then who should?

   Do tell me, as my knowl­edge on the topic is deficient.

   ushathe elite ‚an eng­lish speak­ing, blog reader/ com­menter..
   Do u mean only peo­ple who speak eng­lish are elite?? Its just another lan­guage and does not cer­tify intel­li­gence or con­fer a supe­ri­or­ity to the speaker.

9. Kishore says:
   

   November 23rd, 2005 at 9:03 am (#)

   Inter­est­ingly, though man­nina maga makes some valid points it seemed to have got derailed due to emo­tional attacks and deroga­tory remarks to fel­low indi­ans just because they are non-kannadigas.. But aspects of IT he brought out here are some­thing to talk about -
   —
   Some facts about IT.

   Infosys has more than 1000 acres of agri land, stolen from peo­ple using the govt. as a bro­ker. A cou­ple of years ago when farm­ers protested against it in a press con­fer­ence, they were forcibly thrown out.

   They have not even paid fully the cur­rent facil­ity they are squat­ting on in E City.

   They have not paid one paise as Income tax to cen­tral govt.

   They have not yet cleared the arears for com­mer­cial taxes to the state. The out­stand­ing amt is upwards of 500 cr.

   The total peo­ple employed by IT in india is 2.5 mil­lion. The total num­ber directly employed in gar­ments are atleast 50 mil­lion. More peo­ple get jobs directly from gar­ments than in IT.
   —

   So, why is there so much hype and demand for spe­cial treat­ment by IT?

   Its ban­ga­lore and kar­nataka, all the peo­ple in it that should ben­e­fit. The rich — poor divide should decrease. But within Ban­ga­lore city we see that gap to have expo­nen­tially increased. Isn’t that bad when only the rich get richer and poor keeps get­ting poorer??

   We should work together and adress issues as adults. Debate does help to an extent and might even pro­pel one to act forward.

10. Ullas says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 11:44 am (#)

    @Manning Maga
    “After­all you only talk of ban­ga­lore and your global cit­i­zen ideas. What about those liv­ing out­side ban­ga­lore (lit­er­ally and figuratively) ? ”

    So, going by the same logic, why is it that you talk only about Kan­nadi­gas and not Indi­ans at large? Or is it that the con­di­tion of India doesn’t affect you?

11. Ullas says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 11:48 am (#)

    JUST A COUPLE OF POINTS FROM ANITA’S POST ON ROADS

    Case to point. There are 2 approaches to my house. One of these has been under con­struc­tion for the last one year, I kid you not! One year. How it can take one year to dig up a road, put cables under it and patch it up again is beyond every stretch of my imagination.

    The other approach was also dug up and hastily reopened. At one point of time, I thought we’d have to actu­ally get swings or large cat­a­pults to get across the large drain if they had closed both the roads at the same time.

    ***********

    Mr. Man­ning Maga,

    Would you blame the so-called prej­u­dice against Kan­nadi­gas for the fate of these roads? Or is it that these bad roads exist only for non-Kannadigas?

12. Mohit says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 12:39 pm (#)

    As noted ear­lier, Man­nina maga has a cou­ple of valid points :
    1. Edu­ca­tion has become expen­sive in ban­ga­lore
    2. Hous­ing has become expen­sive in bangalore.

    Now my ques­tion — How is IT respon­si­ble for this? No one wants to pay extra for any­thing. Even if I had a zil­lion rupees with my (yeah right!) would I pay more for some­thing just because I can? No! I will pay more if I see that its the pre­vail­ing rate. If the schools now ask for dona­tions, its because they see peo­ple who can be made to pay. Peo­ple are not the issue here, schools are.… ditto for builders… and for that mat­ter veg­etable ven­dors, auto dri­vers and every­one else.

    Instead of blindly fol­low­ing what the politi­cians say, try and think for your­self. I agree that things need to change but don’t let any­one else decide what you fight for.

13. Anindita says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 2:44 pm (#)

    Totally with you on this, Anita. Thank you for putting it down so well. Please don’t get upset by peo­ple who don’t even have the courage to own up to their own opin­ions. But then if I was as narrow-minded as anony­mous, I would prob­a­bly wish to hide my face too. :D

14. hemanth says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 4:22 pm (#)

    I don’t seem to under­stand the crib here. kannadiga’s and espe­cially ban­ga­lore­ans are prob­a­bly the most tol­er­ant and broad­minded peo­ple amongst all other south indian cities / states !! There is no other place where peo­ple from other states (whose mother tongue is not kan­nada) can live in per­fect har­mony with­out under­stand­ing or speak­ing an iota of kannada !!!!

    Give me one other city where this is possible !!!

    In every other city, a per­son who is not well ver­sant with the local lan­guage gets treated as an “OUTSIDER” or “UNTOUCHABLE” !!! I am stat­ing this from my per­sonal experiences.

15. Mannina maga says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 4:42 pm (#)

    Amit Sharma said — “Mr Loser is fight­ing a los­ing bat­tle. We should carry on with our lives with­out pay­ing any heed to the crap he talks. No amount of jus­ti­fi­ca­tion can con­vince our dear friend.”

    Good for you Amit. But you know there is a his­tor­i­cal say­ing. “Ignore the poor at your own peril”.

    paavi said — ” I am NEVER going to con­cur with the extreme view points presented.”

    I think extrem­i­ties bring out the many con­sci­en­tial peo­ple among the IT indus­try to think out of their bub­ble and not just cry all the time about their own small dis­com­forts. When I see the extreme poverty and cal­lous­ness our civil soci­ety treats the down­trod­den, I think it is ok to be extreme. Infact it is bet­ter to be extreme than to be blind.

    Sameer said — ” : So Mr Magaa — Are you try­ing to do the same now here in Ban­ga­lore? Is it your revenge that’s direct­ing you? Instead I sup­pose you should try harder to see to it that Ban­ga­lore treats all it’s cit­i­zens at par and set an exam­ple for other cities to fol­low. India is one, we all are one! Let’s respect our peo­ple and our unity in diversity!”

    Thanks a lot sameer. The issue how­ever is IT sym­bol­ises the col­lec­tive fail­i­ure of the India shin­ing brigade to take other peo­ple along. Infra­struc­ture means infra­struc­ture for the rich. Any­thing for the poor is clas­si­fied as deficit spending/subsidies in the anals of finance min­istry. IT is the symp­tom of that. The dis­ease runs deeper than that in the hand of few rich indus­tri­al­ists and a few crore of foot sol­diers (mid­dle class) who col­lude with the rich to get a lit­tle share of the booty. All I am say­ing is dont mas­quer­ade as doing good for India. When­ever you say that, ask your­self the ques­tion Is it the India liv­ing in kora­man­gala and Indra nagar ? or the true India that lives in vil­lages and earn near sub­si­tance liv­ing. IT is the rea­son every­thing got derailed in Kar­nataka. A sec­tor which employs 300,000 peo­ple out of 50,000,000 peo­ple should enjoy just .6 per cent of fund­ing, atten­tion and sub­si­dies. What IT is get­ting is much big­ger than its share and this eats into all other devel­ope­men­tal plans of the govt.

    @Kishore — I am really glad atlest some of you see through the mir­rage of IT. The fun­ni­est part is all these sen­si­tive folks dont have it in them to answer those facts that I have put up. Its a super­fi­cial “Mile sur mera thu­mara” syn­drome of ask­ing the hun­gry com­mon man to hold up the indian flag and feel proud while the rest of them go on loot­ing the com­mon man. I feel sorry because there are many among them who pre­tend to sleep. As you know you cant wake these peo­ple up.

    Ullas — “So, going by the same logic, why is it that you talk only about Kan­nadi­gas and not Indi­ans at large? Or is it that the con­di­tion of India doesn’t affect you?”

    I am talk­ing about con­di­tion of India. Isnt bel­lary, bidar part of India ? Isnt a kan­nadiga an Indian ? Do you have any doubts on that. I thought a bet­ter kar­nataka means a bet­ter India. Thats the India that I believe in. Not the India liv­ing in the cities and trav­el­ling around in large cars. Its funny you even have such doubts.

    Ullas fur­ther said — “Would you blame the so-called prej­u­dice against Kan­nadi­gas for the fate of these roads? Or is it that these bad roads exist only for non-Kannadigas?”

    I think you mis­un­der­stood me (giv­ing you the ben­e­fit of doubt). I am say­ing I care a rats ass for the road con­di­tion in ban­ga­lore. I care for the road con­di­tion in bel­lary. Enough of show­ing the flag of ban­ga­lore and get­ting free money. Why dont the per­son put some of her own money and fix that road. Arent those peo­ple liv­ing in the area rich enough ? The peo­ple in the vil­lages all over this coun­try have time and again pooled in money and labour to fix the vil­lage well, roads, lakes and tanks. This com­mu­nity liv­ing exists out­side of ban­ga­lore and has been so for cen­turies. Maybe the answer is you guys think as indi­vid­u­als and not as a com­mu­nity. Which is ok as long as you stop preach­ing India and Indi­an­ness to others.

    Mohit said — “Now my ques­tion — How is IT respon­si­ble for this? No one wants to pay extra for any­thing. Even if I had a zil­lion rupees with my (yeah right!) would I pay more for some­thing just because I can? No! I will pay more if I see that its the pre­vail­ing rate. If the schools now ask for dona­tions, its because they see peo­ple who can be made to pay. Peo­ple are not the issue here, schools are…. ditto for builders… and for that mat­ter veg­etable ven­dors, auto dri­vers and every­one else.

    Instead of blindly fol­low­ing what the politi­cians say, try and think for your­self. I agree that things need to change but don’t let any­one else decide what you fight for.”

    Mohit. Ben­nerghetta road has over 40 major res­i­den­tial com­plexes com­ing up. Each has atleast 1000 apart­ments if not more which is a min­i­mum of 40,000 fam­i­lies. Add to that offices (HSBC, accen­ture, IBM etc. ) another 40,000 peo­ple. Which means 80,000 cars and atleast 60,000 kids (hav­ing an aver­age of 1.5 kids per house­hold). Also add onto this com­plex enter­tain­ment infra­struc­ture for these elites which would mean 80,000 park­ing lots, malls, cine­plexes etc. etc. Why should the govt spend money to make these people’s liv­ing world class. Instead why not put the same money in the vil­lages to life atleast 50–75 lakh peo­ple out of poverty. These 40,000 house­holds would screw up the rent, prices of veg­eta­bles and make com­mon man’s exis­tance a lot more dif­fi­cult. Dont believe me ? The cost of onions and pota­toes in sar­japur mar­ket is 3 times that of KR mar­ket on any given day. The land prices have been dou­bling every 4 months all across ban­ga­lore. I think this model is not sus­tain­able. We got to push up the rural econ­omy even at the cost of IT.

    Anin­dita said — ” Thank you for putting it down so well. Please don’t get upset by peo­ple who don’t even have the courage to own up to their own opin­ions. But then if I was as narrow-minded as anony­mous, I would prob­a­bly wish to hide my face too. :D”

    Anin­dita. Its sad that instead of answer­ing ques­tions or rais­ing more ques­tions, you seek to rub­bish my words just based on weather I have a blog id or not… really how does tha mat­ter. Would really like to know.

16. Suman says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 4:58 pm (#)

    Yaaaaaaaawnnnnnnnn!

17. Amit Sharma says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 5:38 pm (#)

    I have few con­clu­sions from the response of our dear friend.I’m sure Man­na­m­aga is on BENCH in Infy else noone can dare writ­ing such long long responses. His home town is Bel­lary because he keeps talk­ing about it. He’s a con­gress­man as Bel­lary also hap­pens to be the con­stituency of Sonia Gandhi. Man­na­m­aga buys his onions form KR Mar­ket. I’m sure he’s an economist/engineer see­ing all sta­tis­tics he’s given. :)

    Buddy you are wast­ing your tal­ent here, if u r so con­cerned then put these words across to the govt. Why can’t you see pos­i­tive things in life. Even poor men are happy except you. Each accu­sa­tions of ur can be coun­tered but then its a never end­ing loop, u accuse and oth­ers answer and so on. Now dont start crib­bing again.

18. paavai says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 7:39 pm (#)

    Have you heard of “Sudha Murthy” “Azim Pre­mji foun­da­tion” that “Hon­ey­well has social work as one of their values”

    Just because one works for IT, it does not mean that poverty does not move them or they are not doing any­thing for the poor and needy. One does not have to take extreme stance to mit­i­gate these, the mid­dle path can also bring in results.

19. Sudarshan says:
    

    November 23rd, 2005 at 7:59 pm (#)

    You ask any cit­i­zen (out­sider or insider how­ever you wish to address who has lived for more than 10 years in Ban­ga­lore) what has been the main con­trib­u­tor of this pathetic state of affairs and you’ll hear “IT” more often than “Deve gowda”.

    Lets admit it, a city which was designed to house 20 lakh has taken in 400% more in the last decade or so mainly because of IT and related ser­vices. True, it was the Government’s prob­lem to spec­u­late and make adjust­ments but with the preva­lent red­tapism, what more can you expect? The once seen huge plots gave way to multi sto­ried apart­ments and com­mer­cial buildings…i.e. if a 60X40 plot had one bun­ga­low, the real estate guys built four storey build­ing on the same plot thus increas­ing the pop­u­la­tion 4 fold, imag­ine what would be the state if 10 such build­ings come up in the same road. Ok, you want to argue that the Cor­po­ra­tion should not have given the permission…fine, now they want to cor­rect their mis­takes, will you give them a chance? If yes, talk to the Kora­man­gala residents.

    And half the time, every­body talks about pay­ing Income Tax. You are pay­ing to the cen­ter and the state gets only a frac­tion of that. What do you expect the state gov­ern­ment to do with the lit­tle chunk? Should they con­cen­trate on under devel­oped parts of the state or still cater to the ever demand­ing IT fraternity?

    Most of the IT bosses say that a Pub­lic – Pri­vate part­ner­ship is required to cor­rect the state of affairs of Ban­ga­lore. They should first start the char­ity at home.. why don’t they admit that they have raped the city left, right and cen­ter and stop this insane expan­sion and go and set up shop in other parts of the coun­try? Don’t you think its going to do a lot good for the coun­try in gen­eral and the respec­tive states in particular?

    Even if the Gov­ern­ment of Arunachal Pradesh gives free land, 25 years Income tax hol­i­day to Narayan Murthy, will he open a devel­op­ment cen­ter there? He won’t do it…the only inter­est that the IT bosses have is to make money and live in air con­di­tioned rooms. Because of this short sighted atti­tude of the rich, that we, the cit­i­zens of India have to bow our heads in shame at the sorry state of affairs in states like Bihar, UP and other NE states.

    There seems to be a whole lot of Jain Hinds doing rounds, but are we doing our duty like law abid­ing cit­i­zens? Instead of crib­bing about the present gov­ern­ment, why don’t you pres­sur­ize the State where you hail from to encour­age invest­ments in IT. That reduces the migra­tion and brings down a whole lot of other prob­lems to a great extent.

    You visit the old local­i­ties of Ban­ga­lore dur­ing rains and see if they are fac­ing the hardship..you’ll know the cor­rect rea­son. If every indi­vid­ual who has bought an apart­ment in new local­i­ties like Indi­rana­gar, Kora­man­gala, HSR lay­out or work­ing in new age cen­ters had checked if the plans were in order and as per Cor­po­ra­tion law, half the prob­lem would have been solved.

20. Ullas says:
    

    November 24th, 2005 at 11:36 am (#)

    “I am talk­ing about con­di­tion of India. Isnt bel­lary, bidar part of India ? Isnt a kan­nadiga an Indian ? Do you have any doubts on that. I thought a bet­ter kar­nataka means a bet­ter India. Thats the India that I believe in. Not the India liv­ing in the cities and trav­el­ling around in large cars. Its funny you even have such doubts. ”

    Funny isn’t it? If you are so con­cerned about India at large, then how come the whole OUTSIDER busi­ness began with you? And who­ever talked about India being in the cities…India lies equally in the vil­lages as in the cities but call­ing an Indian an out­sider in an Indian city is noth­ing short of criminal…time you shook off the pseudo-Indianness…

21. Account amount forex mini. says:
    

    May 16th, 2007 at 1:23 pm (#)

    Account amount forex mini.

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